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FSX crashed

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pilote1075 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pilote1075 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: FSX crashed
    Posted: June-29-2007 at 8:40pm
after 10 minutes of flight online with ivao fsx and atr crashed help me
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cpt_pickard View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cpt_pickard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-16-2007 at 4:05pm
Pretty much the same here, although the time seem pretty random between 10 mins and one hour.

Dan
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Thierry View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thierry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-16-2007 at 5:01pm

Hi guys,

I also use the ATR on IVAO network, and now it work better than at the beginning. I can't affirm that I have no more crash, but It seems that my FSX is now more stable. Why ?

First, I use the latest release of IVAP (only in windowed mode, but I think that your problems don't come from IVAP software). Myself, I use a beta release of IVAP (1.9.3), but there is few difference with the public release.

I think, that the most important thing to do when using FSX, is to edit your dll.xml file (if you have the full FSX edition - but who have the basic LOL - this is well explained in the SDK documentation on you DVD). In this file, I have set ALL dll to "Manual load". By example, for FSUIPC I have the following lines in my dll.xml (this file is located in "Documents and settings/xxxx/Application Data/Microsoft/FSX/dll.xml") :

<Name>FSUIPC 4</Name>
<Disabled>False</Disabled>
<ManualLoad>True</ManualLoad>
<Path>Modules\FSUIPC4.dll</Path>

This cause FSX ask at the startup if you want to load xxxx.dll files (ie, FSUIPC, Traffic Toolbox, IVAP)...

Then, when I start FSX, I reply NO for all dll, except for Ivap_bootstrap (of course because I want to fly with IVAP).

I think, that most of crashes comes from FSUIPC...

About FSUIPC : OK, this program was fantastic for FS9 (and previous) because it was an easy way to interface  with MSFS. But now, Microsoft has published the Simconnect API, and there is no reason to continue to use FSUIPC.
I'm myself a registered user of FSUIPC (and WideFS, for both FS9 and FSX), but I have decide to ban this program from my FS, because there is no good reason to keep it (was perfect for FS9, but know time has evolved, and a new page should be written).

And please, AVOID all products that claim that they use FSUIPC with FSX !!! If they were REAL FSX products, they should used "simconnect" API and not FSUIPC.

Microsoft, in the FSX SDK has said something important, and it's true : developping add-ons for FSX may be done using two ways : as dll or as external exe. The second method is highly recommended (IVAP is written this way, except for the bootstrap that allow to load the main IVAP form FSX menu). If you write a dll, in case of bug you will crash FSX (because the dll is loaded by FSX, and is considered as part of him), and you don't get the benefit of multi-core CPU (if you write an external program, it can run on one core while FSX run on another). FSUIPC is a dll, so in case of bug... FSX crash, and you're not able to say wether the bug is in FSX or FSUIPC.  In case of external program bug, only this program hang, and FSX continue to run safe.

So, I have disable all dll's at startup, and now it seems that this work better Smile.

I also own some new Airbus and Citation, and avoid to fly with them on IVAO, because they use specifics gauge (again some dll), written with C/C++ (and of course, with many bugs and memory leakage, that cause FSX hang). F1ATR gauges seems to be better...

Remember, also to start with a basic plane (not complex), before loading the ATR.

Regards.
Thierry.

 

 

 

 

 

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cpt_pickard View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cpt_pickard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-16-2007 at 5:07pm
Well, basically if I read it right - the solution that perhaps gets ATR going with IvAp makes various other add ons unusable...?

Dan
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Thierry View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thierry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-17-2007 at 1:30am

Yes, but temporary.

Disabling others add-ons will help to identify thoses that are uncompatable.
Using this method, I can test the ATR alone with the minimal FSX (I can test without any dll, and if FSX crash, this can be either FSX fault or ATR, but cannot involve bugs in others dll).

Of course, you also need to load a (clean) basic aircraft before the ATR, to avoid to load (again) "stranges" dll from gauges. Because, if you load before a complex aircraft (like some airbus...), you will load dll (gauge) into memory, and if (as...) there is bugs, it can interact with further modules loaded in memory. So use a basic aircraft before, ensure to not load such dll.

Also avoid to load an aircraft with G1000 panels... I experience myself some CTD with this one, and it seems that there is also some bugs from Microsoft (not tested till I get SP1).

If sometimes you get stranges messages like "Memory cannot be read/written at ####" and FSX crash, it's sure it don't come from your system (quality of memory). This is merely a bug (memory leakage) in gauge programming (using C/C++ language). I think that some gauge have only be tested on system with few (!) memory. With sytems with huge amount of memory somes problems may happen because of bugs in gauges. FSX use something that about 700 MB in memory (depending on aircrafts, sceneries... ) so the minimal configuration should be 2 GB (1 GB will work, but with others softwares loaded, you wil get memory swap).

For FSUIPC : you don't need it with IVAP. The ATR work finewith IVAP even if FSUIPC is not loaded.

The ATR TCAS (not the IVAP ones) detect also IVAP traffics : it work fine on IVAO, I have made some tests, and I get some TA and also some RA. IVAP traffic is exactly the same as AI traffic, so gauges based on AI aircrafts (the basic of FSX) will work fine with IVAP. I personnaly set traffic arround me to 40 nm (so that I get them as soon as IVAP TCAS is able to detect them - max range of IVAP TCAS is 40 nm). You can check that using the "Traffic toolbox" tools, provided with FSX SDK on your DVD.

But ATR TCAS has also a funny bug : it's sure that this gauge has been directly imported from FS9 release, but FSX has some improvment not teken into account by this gauge... as I say in this post http://atr.flight1.net/forums/forum_posts.asp?TID=3573 , TCAS detect also traffic on ground LOL. This is because of new FSX feature, now, ground traffic can be set independently from others, and this was not available with FS9.

So, making an aircraft for FSX is not easy... importing them from FS9 is not enough, and cannot be made as easy as between FS8 and FS9.

Thierry.

 

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cpt_pickard View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cpt_pickard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-17-2007 at 6:31am

Well I don't want to start my usual whining but this looks like too much fiddling for a fifty bucks add-on. I am not a beta tester, I am a paying customer and would somehow appreciate a functional product. I of course know that SW is a complicated thing, HW is a complicated thing and everything is hard and difficult to get together, nevertheless I have paid for it and I want it to work.

Of course a popular debate may start now - it is not the ATR it is the: Microsoft, SP1, FSX, nVidia, FSUIPC, Intel, IvAp, Sound Blaster and my mouse pad. I am not buying that. Everything else works in these conditions, therefore it IS the ATR who's the culprit. I pretty much had the same debate with the Level D 767 - It is SURELY not the 767. No, surely not. Only now there's a service pack and bingo, everything works. But it wasn't the 767, sure. [IMG]smileys/smiley2.gif" align="middle" />

I believe Flight 1 put all the efforts to this release. It flies perfectly and system simulation is excellent. I believe the compatibility issue will be tackled soon as well. Maybe the product has not been even tested with IvAp. Maybe it is just some minor issue easy to handle.

Good luck with that.

Dan
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LH952 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LH952 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-17-2007 at 11:36am

Dan, I fully support your position as per your last post.

I am encountering the same problems (and I dont use IVAP) but I have no suggestions from the developers. I still have not been able to take this bird in the air, it crashes taxiing or on the runway or while starting the engines.

You can look at my previous posts on the subject:

http://atr.flight1.net/forums/forum_posts.asp?TID=3531&KW=&PID=19158#19158

I am still waiting an acknowledgement from the developers....

Ciao

 

CARLO (LH952)
LHVA Junior 1st Off.

FSX
CoralDuoE6600
HD250GB
Ram2GB667mhz
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Hans Hartmann View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hans Hartmann Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-17-2007 at 12:52pm

I'm investigating this problem. Not easy though as I can reproduce neither report. So it's down to "what could(!) possibly cause a crash after ten to sixty minutes".

I'm not an IVAO member so I don't have Ivap.

Best regards,
Hans
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cpt_pickard View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cpt_pickard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-17-2007 at 1:44pm
Well that may be the problem. In my case the add on works perfectly without IvAp and crashes when online (always... 5 - 50 minutes).
If I am correct, some members reported problems related to weather updates (???). Now IvAp also downloads weather so that may be the issue...?

Dan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LH952 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-17-2007 at 3:59pm

Hans thank you, at least now I know that you are following the issue and I trust that, whatever time it will take, you will sort it out. From the (unfortunately) little I could see your product is an excellent one and I can't wait to fully use it...

I'll watch this Forum (as everyday) hoping to read the solution..

 

Bi for now

 

CARLO (LH952)
LHVA Junior 1st Off.

FSX
CoralDuoE6600
HD250GB
Ram2GB667mhz
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cpt_pickard View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cpt_pickard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-26-2007 at 9:43am
Any update on this?

Dan
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LH952 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LH952 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-26-2007 at 9:56am

I wish there was.... I am still hoping they find a solution...

 

 

CARLO (LH952)
LHVA Junior 1st Off.

FSX
CoralDuoE6600
HD250GB
Ram2GB667mhz
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Hans Hartmann View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hans Hartmann Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-26-2007 at 12:08pm

No, sorry. Still no idea. But let's try something unusual. Carlo, please email me your ATR key so I can install the aircraft using your key here. I know that a few keys didn't work recently although in a completely different way. However, I'd like to check this.

My email address is xxx (please put "ATR key" in the subject line so I can see it, otherwise it might end up in the trash).

Best regards,
Hans
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Hans Hartmann View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hans Hartmann Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-27-2007 at 3:00am
OK. I got the key from Carlo and will check tonight. Unfortunately I'm in the middle of a move (same city, new apartment) so things don't proceed very quickly. I'm on it though.
Best regards,
Hans
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cpt_pickard View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cpt_pickard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-27-2007 at 5:01pm
Nice to hear that the problem is being worked on. No idea if it is the key - I surely have a different one than Carlo. What seems to be quite sure is that the FSX crashes if flying online on IVAO... finding the bug without IvAp online will be probably quite impossible, I think.

Dan
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cpt_pickard View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cpt_pickard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-27-2007 at 5:19pm
BTW anybody has the link to flight one money back service? I don't want to be mean, but on the other hand I fly online ONLY and this one does not work online, so why keep it... If it gets fixed, I am re-buying for sure, it is awesome.

Dan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Todd Nicholson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-01-2007 at 6:46pm
You need to fill out a Service Ticket at the Flight1 website.  Go to www.flight1.com and click on the customer support tab at the top of the page.  There's instructions there for submitting a service ticket.
Regards,
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Hans Hartmann View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hans Hartmann Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-02-2007 at 1:35pm

OK. I give up. I really tried everything from A to Z but no crashes.

I need a full system configuration - every hardware you use, every software that runs when you start FS, exact operating system (like "Vista Business 32-bit French Upgrade from XP" and every driver version - from at least two of you.
That's a lot of work but I don't see another way to find out what happens here.

Best regards,
Hans
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cpt_pickard View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cpt_pickard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-03-2007 at 4:50am
Hi,

did you have IvAp running and were you online on IVAO? That is the only condition that triggers the crash. Without being online on IVAO there is no point in bug hunting.

I will perform a crash this eveing and post as much info as possible here.

All the best.

Dan
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Hans Hartmann View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hans Hartmann Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-03-2007 at 5:39am
No, I'm not an IVAO member but I will apply and check it myself.
Best regards,
Hans
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